PROPOSAL #90 [REJECTED] Community Health research, analytics and benchmarking

Thanks for your answer!

I was just looking to your budget and timeline. If I understand correctly you are targetting a $90k budget of which $60k has already been approved. The remaining $30k is requested from the Cosmos community.
The split in expected spending is a nice $30k. Where is the other $60k spend on?

Because with 16 weeks timeline and $90k funding this means a spending of more than $5k per week. Which is a lot imo for research.

I have been intending to follow up on this post for sometime, but have been delayed due to the flurry of governance activity recently. I suspect this is the case for many others as well.

Thank you @danielo for your proposal. I have attended three RnDAO events and followed along with the work produced by various RnDAO team members. I believe that working with the RnDAO team would be highly beneficial to the Cosmos Hub.

However, I would not advocate for only the creation of the tool. Cosmos Hub governance is currently very young, and lacks the basic foundation that may be present in other DAOs. Likewise, Cosmos has a potentially unique governance model and structure that is related to its underlying principles and values. As such, alongside the creation of the Community Health tooling, I would also advocate for an ongoing RnDAO consultancy effort for the Cosmos Hub. Of course, any such work would need to be coordinated with other entities that may be already serving or seek to serve a similar role. This is indirectly mentioned here:

My overall opinion is that establishing governance foundations are more relevant to the Hub than the development of governance tooling. I also think that RnDAO could provide worthwhile insight to help establish the aforementioned foundation. But, before doing so, we would need coordination across multiple stakeholder groups and clear ownership of the project from the Hub DAO, but I, personally, am not sure where to begin such a coordination effort. There are others like @hxrts @uditvira @Youssef that may be able to provide additional context or thoughts here, however I assume that they are also quite tied up with the ATOM 2.0 whitepaper and Charter Working Draft.

Thanks again @danielo and looking forward to continuing this conversation.


Thanks for asking. So we’re actually spending more than that (our total expense now is projected closer to $150k, most of the shortfall is being covered by the team who deeply believes in this idea). As such, we’re now asking a few more organizations to join Aave, Aragon, MetCartel, and hopefully Cosmos too in helping us advance this project.

The reason for the budget expansion is that now having completed the PoC, we’re targeting the development of a fully functioning tool and will continue to deepen the analysis. This enables us to provide the health assessment not only as a one-off but as the real-time analytics we envision can help community members co-shape their communities on the flight with a deep understanding of the social dynamics taking place. We could also provide insights to not only Cosmos but also other Cosmos-based communities (currently impossible with the PoC given the number of manual tasks required).

We can show you the current prototype over a call (or happy to present it more broadly over an AMA sort of session), as it’s a bit hard to convey the full scope without showing the insights we’re getting. Feel free to message me on what’s suitable and happy to find a time that works :slight_smile:

Thank you for the suggestions!

It’s often tricky to figure out where to start these projects. A few years of consulting experience have taught me the hard way, that’s often best to start with something small and perhaps peripheral that allows us to learn more about how to navigate the ecosystem and then provide the next bit of help.

The community health tool that’s taking shape could provide us that foundation as it allows us to gain an overview of what’s going on, identify key areas for targetted support, and most importantly, know how the initiatives that you/we undertake are impacting the community.

That being said, I’m very open to having a call and exploring how we might support further.

We’re also advancing a separate research project focused on Decision Research in partnership with Mission Publique (a large network of democracy researchers), and they have applied for some funding from Cosmos I understand, so that would allow us to help shape the vision for how governance could evolve over the medium to long term (the short term requiring a faster approach).

In conclusion, I remain at your disposal should you desire to explore how we might support the development of Cosmos’ governance, and encourage us to move forward with the Community Health project as a stepping stone to cultivate the relationship between RnDAO and Cosmos and provide you with value in the short term.

Sounds interesting!

Bold question, can you create a screen recording with spoken text first? Then we can also prepare a call :slight_smile:

I am sure there are some pretty nice community calls which we can join. Citizen Cosmos or Seedizens might be a nice one.

Here’s a quick overview

From that base, we can then do all kind of things based on the network patterns

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In light of recent events, after seeing the product demo, and given that foundational tools are important for building strong structures, I would fully support this proposal.

RnDAO’s work is consistently high-quality, and it would be helpful for the community to take a more methodical approach to measuring and improving community health. Additionally, the community health tool could benefit the Cosmos ecosystem as a whole, as you mentioned:

In line with what @LeonoorsCryptoman said, perhaps we can arrange a call to gather others’ feedback, and start moving toward an on-chain proposal.

Here are proposed steps forward with that in mind:

  • arrange a preliminary call with interested stakeholders (by December 1st)
    • goal: determine a proposal pipeline (how can we get more eyes on the proposal, who do we need to coordinate with, when should we put the proposal on-chain, etc.)
  • input a last-call date for the proposal draft and share the proposal across relevant platforms, such as twitter, telegram
  • host twitter spaces event for the community to learn about the proposal
  • put proposal on-chain

If anyone else is interested in participating in the preliminary call, please leave a comment below and we can work to arrange a call for the week of December 5th. Additionally, I’ve created an open telegram group (you can join by clicking here) to discuss the details of the above proposed path forward, such as call-time planning, twitter space coordination, and other items that are easier-communicated off-forum.

What are all of your thoughts (@danielo, @LeonoorsCryptoman, @lexa, @catdotfish) on that path forward and method of collaborating?

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This sounds great!

Thank you for your support and leadership helping us move it forward

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As a quick update here: a telegram group has been formed to iron out the logistical details of the proposal process (outlined above), those who are interested can join here.

I received some questions related to data privacy and sensitive data that’ll share here as they’re of public interest:

Is it GDPR compliant?

  • The short answer is yes. We’re working with advisors from LexDAO to figure this out. GDPR is a big complex thing (the regulation was heavily influenced by big tech so they’d have a moat). It will take us some time to achieve certification status but we’re taking privacy regulation very seriously.

There are private channels in the Cosmos server with sensitive information, what about those?

  • as the tool is based on a bot, the discord admin can simply not give the bot access to the sensitive channels and that data won’t be collected.

What sort of data does the tool collect?

  • messages data with a focus on interactions (replies, threads, emoji reactions) as this allows us to understand the shape of the network (the organizational network analysis). And we also collect perception data through the pulse survey (respondents can choose not to reply). We do not collect any financial data nor health records data, we won’t ask you for your name, wallet, date of birth, nationality, sexual orientation nor gender.)

let us know if you have any other questions :slight_smile:

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I am very much looking forward to a testcase of this setup. What kind of information and how it is shown in a live dashboard is something I want to play around with to get a feeling of how it can be used and what we can find with the tool.

I believe it is a field which might become much more important in the longer run when we progress, Cosmos and crypto become bigger. Having some kind of metric which shows community health or sentiment (gem of scam) will allow people to have a better judgement whether they want to join a certain project. Or community managers who see the numbers deteriorate have the tools to react earlier.


I tend to agree. I think it’s incredibly useful, especially as the organizational network becomes more complex.

will the entirety of the collected data be publicly available?

The passive data is already publicly available as it’s the very messages in discord. The survey data needs to be private, so we’ll only share the aggregate and not individual responses.
Currently, only our data scientists (doxxed and with ethical data handling training) have access to the raw survey data (anonymized).

This is more for the future, but we’re also exploring a partnership with Maastricht University so their data science students can use the anonymized data for projects and provide insights to the communities. If the partnership comes to fruition, we’ll then invite Cosmos to opt in.

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You’re most welcome to come hang out with us for the UX/UI meetings. I’m also open to do 1-1 with those interested.
We’re hosting regular sessions in the RnDAO server, so you can just join and say hi in intros and I’ll orient you :slight_smile: :

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so this is a proposal for funding to develop surveillance tooling for the cosmos across platforms?
How do you plan to motivate participation? I dont find pulse surveys appealing at all. it sounds like you are pitching the addition of pop-ups to the user experience.

Your proposal is entirely unclear what your proposal is going to provide the cosmos. it defines Community Health = health of its community and its vibez…what does that even mean?

You say you are currently in week 5 of roadmap, then below, claim you are in week 9.

I dont think I would vote for increased survailance of the cosmos and its participants, especially when i dont see any basis or metrics to value potential success of the community health metrics you have yet to disclose or conceive.

Would agree with the above. What are some of the likely benefits for the Cosmos community? “Vibez” is great and all, but the sum you’re asking for is not insignificant. What would the Cosmos be able to do with the data that your project might be able to provide?

Hey, thanks for raising these points. Really important to clarify!

Defining Community Health is itself a lot of work (we know that number of members in discord or the number of messages are just vanity metrics. But what are good metrics?!). We’ve already been at it for some time, and you can read about our progress so far here. This article is a work in progress so part of the grant is to validate that this is a good framework, in practice. So the question you’re asking is part of the deliverables.

Also, I’d invite a difference between surveillance tooling and community analytics. One thing is mapping the behavior of a specific person (e.g. like Karma does for reputation). Different from that is getting aggregate insights (not disclosing the behavior of any specific individual but overall patterns and trends) so that the community can know what to focus on. The difference is the same between disclosing that an individual voted in favor of proposal X vs disclosing that 55% of the population voted in favor.

If you see our framework in the article, we’ve identified a series of key areas that determine a community’s resilience, sense of ownership and participation, well-being, etc. The insights we aim to provide are about helping the community to discover the biggest levers they can work on.

Finally, for the pulse survey, I’ll offer the following framing:
What motivates you or any other member to discuss here? I’d hope it’s about making this community better
Answering pulse surveys can be another way to do that. Popsups are annoying because they usual take value away rather than adding it. And along the same lines, surveys are often disengaging because they’re long, it’s not clear what impact answering has, and it takes months to analyze the data and take some initiative. Our proposal addresses those shortfalls with short surveys and fast feedback loops so the community can quickly respond and take action, and in doing so, show to others that having a voice has an impact, so more and more are motivated to answer every time. If used well, it creates a positive feedback loop of questions, insights, initiatives, and improvement.
Importantly, answering questions is not only useful for the person asking. Coaching is mostly based on asking useful questions to offer reflection and for the individual to generate their own insights (more powerful than having some stranger tell you what to do). In the same way, the pulse surveys can offer a moment of reflection, a prompt to stop the busy work for a moment and check in with ourselves about how we’re doing and how things are going, and then share that with the community. This will take some work, but it’s the route we want to work towards.

Hope that makes sense @common_spelling?

Hey @saint.Ericus, please see my answer above and let me know if you still have any doubts or concerns. Happy to answer if so!

For me this remains a very interesting test to do and see what comes out. The amount of funding is not enormous imo and worth a gamble.

If it proves successful then it will be a very powerful tool for the complete ecosystem and people to analyze a project based on community engagement. This can be converted into opportunities to make projects more successful.

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